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sportgy |
Getting out of mount position in submission fighting |
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For a novice type, whats the easiest and simplest way of getting out of the mont position, say when the opp is slightly heavier and a bit more experienced than u?
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Myles MMA |
Re: Getting out of mount position in submission fighting | ||
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Read Levos post on pin escapes in this forum to get the basic principles. Levo is really the man for this but the two basic stratergies are shrimp, shrimp, shrimp etc... until you end up sliding through them (90% hips, 10% arms). The other is drill the bridge and roll. I'm a small guy and have heard alot of people say it doesn't work on large opponents. Thats basically bollocks, if you roll at a 45 degree angle you can get anyone off you.
Levo care to explain properly. BBKS (Bruised, Battered, Knackered, Smiling)
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Levo |
Re: Getting out of mount position in submission fighting | ||
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The tips in the pin escapes thread (timing, posture, hip movement, combinations etc) are all important in escaping the mount so you might want to check that out. As Myles said, the "shrimp" and "bridge" are the key movments with mount escapes. As for the actual escapes IMO there are 3 fundamental ones that need to be worked a lot: Elbow-knee escape (shrimp), Upa (bridge and roll) and the foot drag. Here are some quick descriptions off the top of my head (do a web search for better ones): 1. Elbow-knee escape (shrimp) - keeping him on your hips turn on to side (eg right). Have top (left) forearm on his beltline, other forearm (right) inside his (left) thigh with both hands at his (left) hip. Bump hips up, shrimp away from his legs and away from your hands to create some space. Bring your bottom knee up through your arms and bewteen his legs (you can only do this if you are on your side with leg against the mat) using your (right) elbow against the inside of his knee (left) to create space. Using both hands and shin of the (right) leg you brought through to keep his weight off you turn and shrimp in other direction bringing other (left) leg between his legs to guard. 2. Upa (bridge and roll) - trap an arm to your chest (or block his tricep if he is wrapping your head) and place sole of foot on the mat on the outside of his ankle to trap his foot. You now have the arm and leg on one side trapped so he can't base out. With feet close to your butt bridge hips straight up high to ceiling first sending his weight forward then in one movement turn over shoulder to side you've blocked off at 45 degrees to reverse him. End in good posture. Do not simply try to roll to side or let butt go back down after initial bridge, hips go straight up high first and stay up as you roll/hip heist to side. Here's an example I found doing a quick search. 3. Foot drag - start like elbow-knee escape but you can't get bottom knee through his legs (perhaps he pinches knees together against your body). You must be on your side with bottom leg (eg right) out flat to floor. Reach over with heel of other (left) foot and hook his (left) ankle. Pull with your (left)foot, push with (right) elbow against his (left) knee and lift your (right) knee along the mat on outside of his leg simultaneously to trap his (left) leg in your half guard. Either complete as an elbow-knee escape or attack from half guard. Here's an example I found doing a quick search. Once you get the basic moves you need to combine them. For example, if he bases out against an Upa escape his weight will be off his legs making the elbow-knee escape easier. If he pinches his knees to stop an elbow-knee escape his foot may be close enough to catch for a foot drag escape and/or his base may be weak enough to get an Upa. Again, timing is key on these escapes and the importance of hip movement cannot be emphasised enough. Nathan |
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sportgy |
Re: Getting out of mount position in submission fighting | ||
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tx levo
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mmalad |
Re: Getting out of mount position in submission fighting | ||
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Leg lock.
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a1geeg |
Re: Getting out of mount position in submission fighting | ||
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thats excellant.but which do you think is the most realistic escape ,especially if sum1 is raining punches down on your head?or are they all just equally as effective?
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Levo |
Re: Getting out of mount position in submission fighting | ||
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By "realistic" I assume you mean which are more applicable to MMA? MMA isn't really my thing (better off asking others on this forum) but I'll give you my thoughts, take them or leave them: Obviously, the best advice is not to be on the bottom. Irritating but true. Although the inclusion of strikes cannot be ignored, to some degree grappling is grappling. If you are very good at the basic grappling escapes you should be able to still use them (with a little modification). If a grappler with top draw escapes finds himself being mounted he should be able to have his opponent off balance and in the guard in a split second before taking much punishment. Now, using those escapes comes down to good timing. They should be performed AS he takes the mount. If he is already there you are in deep sh!t, it's as simple as that. Watch modern MMA fights, if someone gets mount and the opponent hasn't escaped straight away it's often the beginning of the end (unless he is saved by the bell). So, if the guy is mounted what can you do. Not much. If you watch fights nearly everyone either covers up in a boxing posture or hugs the body and buries their head to try and reduce the punishment. Neither are gonna save you. Best advice I can give is to develop a strong bridge. Clean escapes that do occur in MMA tend to be reversals using a bridge. If it doesn't work it'll probably get their hands on the floor to base and weight shifted to one side so you might be able to shrimp and put him in your guard or kick him away. One last option. I'm not recommending this, only mentioning it as it has worked in fights. Sometimes it may be better to turn, give your back, and escape from there. Not where you want to be but if you are going to get KO/TKOd anyway it might be worth a shot. The back mount can sometimes be easier to get out of. Also, with the back of the head now an illegal target and the gloves making the choke a little harder than before it may not be as bad as it once was. Again, not a recommendation, just an idea. Keep in mind that if someone is in the mount it may be luck but could equally mean they have taken you down, passed your guard, got side control and passed to mount. This means what? They are probably better than you. Escaping is gonna be very hard. Nathan |
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xm27 |
Re: Getting out of mount position in submission fighting | ||
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To stop someone from punching you from the mount - so that you can escape from underneath the mount position, the first thing you need to remember is to keep them mounted as low down your body as you can. This first rule is vital, as a high mount will nullify your bridge attempts to a large degree, and make movement etc far more difficult for you.
Ideally you will keep your oponent mounted at around your waist - lower if possible. This does three things; 1. Alters the angle of his shots, so they are less straight down. 2. Means your upa will achieve more impact, elevating him higher. 3. Allow you more freedom to move your upper body to switch through your mount escape reportoire. To keep the guy low on your body you must prevent him from moving his knees into a position high up under your armpits. If he gets there, then your bridge/upa movements will have a much more limited impact on his balance (try it and see). To prevent him from moving high, you must keep your elbows tight to your sides. To prevent a fighter from 'effectively' punching you from the mount, you must bridge (upa) each time he sits up to punch. By doing this you cast his weight forward, forcing him to post his hands to stop his balance from going. Don't try to hug him around the waist - if he has a good ground game you will hand him an armlock by doing this - there are 3 easy armlocks from this position (maintaining the mount). You must keep both of your legs flat on the ground and tight together the second you conseed the mount position. If you leave them up (ready to bridge) you allow the guy time to lace his legs (grapevine) and ride your position, seeking to wear you out. With your legs flat he cannot get his hooks in effectively. Once you have the guy low on your waist, your legs flat to the ground, your elbows in tight, you have the makings of your mount escape. You can use any of the moves Levo has suggested above. To perform the bridge and roll from the position i have suggested you be in, you First bring you heels up together, and place them flat against your butt. This must be done fast, and with good timing. Your Bridge hard and get you butt back down fast. This will knock your opponent off balance (any punches he throws will get sent high). getting your backside down quick prevents him from grapevining your legs - remember - your feet (heels) must be close to your butt - so close he cannot fit his feet in to grapevine you. Now, you have him posted forward with both hands, or at least one on the floor. From here you can apply the bridge and roll technique. Another alternative i like, is once i have him forward, his weight is evenly balanced between (usually) four points (2 arms and 2 knees). From here i place my hands on his hips (if my elbows are tight to my ribs, they will be practically there when i upa him forward. From this position, ready to upa again, with my hands on his hips, I bridge hard and push with my hands, elevating his body upwards, and then hold his weight momentarily with my arms, dropping my butt down fast. This creates a space between him and me, leaving him literally hanging in the air - he cannot punch because most of his weight is now going through his arms. I raise both knees together fast, slipping them between his legs, and then i let him fall - landing on my shins. From here i push him away, putting him into my butterfly guard. I find this works very effectively, but it has to be done very quickly. All of the escapes will work, but to do them well you need to practice them slowly first - perfect the movements (so they become precise and natural under pressure), then develop the techniques under more speed and finally under the pressure from punches. The more advanced and technical you opponent is on the ground, the better you have to be in terms of timing, switching between techniques fluidly and rapidly, and precision. Hope this helps. Hot Air. |
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sportgy |
Re: Getting out of mount position in submission fighting | ||
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tx guys
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dolorem |
Re: Getting out of mount position in submission fighting | ||
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If he's throwing punches at you whilst in mount position, all you need to do is sit up and wrap your arms around his ribs and then lie back down, pulling him down on top of you. From that, use the "Upa" escape.
Keep him close to you, hold him against your body, catch your breath if you need to and then use sudden, explosive movement to burst out of it. You'll land in his guard and, generally speaking, if he's a ground n pound guy then he won't like being on his back and the advantage is yours... provided you work quickly |
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sportgy |
Re: Getting out of mount position in submission fighting | ||
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im now relatively (compared to rest of my game) good Getting out of mount position in submission fighting but not sure what to do when so doing my opponent puts out a leg as a base to stop me bridging him
if he does that can i do a triangle or armbar? |
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jogs1 |
Re: Getting out of mount position in submission fighting | ||
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When trying to bridge your opponent you should be trapping his arm & leg on the side you're going to bridge your opponent to.
To add to this you shouldn't bridge straight to the side. Trap the opponent's arm and leg on the same side, then bridge directly upwards and at the last minute twist your hips to the side that you've trapped.... You've got all the theory now - the best way to learn this now is to apply it in sparring - let the guy mount you and keep working on your escapes. Regards Jogs The Singh Warrior "When all other means have failed,
it is but lawful to take to the sword." Guru Gobind Singh Ji |
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sportgy |
Re: Getting out of mount position in submission fighting | ||
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tx jogs
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